Throughline · holding view Deep analysis Q4 FY25
TCS Tata Consultancy Services Ltd · IT services Q4 FY25 · concall
Pattern: tcv mix between renewals

FY26 wrapped: -2.4% CC revenue but 4-year-high 25% margin, $40.7B TCV.

4 weak · 20 clean pushback across 4 of 24 Q&A turns

Focused evidence 4 of 24

Sudheer Guntupalli · Kotak Mahindra AMCweak

Order booking this quarter has been strong with no mega deal. Any color on the mix between renewals and new deals vs December quarter?

We've not been giving exact split. But in terms of percentage, there is no major change between renewal and new. Similarly, between cost optimization programs and discretionary programs also, there has not been a major change compared to last quarter.

Ravi Menon · Macquarieweak

Did you do a lot of higher and lateral hires this quarter? Is that part of the reason employee costs are up?

Our campus hires are going as per plan. Our lateral hires come in every quarter, depending on the business situation. That is how we have been operating all along.

Kumar Rakesh · BNP Paribasweak

On deal TCV which has picked up over last two quarters - what has changed between first half and second half? Any color on mix?

To some extent, in 2H, TCV tends to be lumpy. I don't want to read too much into something change. But what happened is we were able to close more deals compared to before. In terms of mix also, I don't see a significant mix change between 1H and 2H, in terms of discretionary versus non-discretionary or renewal vs new. The mix has been by and large the same. So there is no major difference. There have been more closures in Q3 and Q4, resulting in higher TCV.

Other Q&A (20)
Yogesh Aggarwal · HSBC Securities

At the media conference you mentioned tactical investments which weighed on margins this quarter. Can you elaborate?

I meant tactical interventions, which had a sequential margin impact of 100 basis points. And those are primarily promotions, which were effective 1st of January.

Yogesh Aggarwal · HSBC Securities

What drove these promotions when growth was slow and wage hikes for next year are uncertain?

It is not that promotions were not planned earlier. It is in its normal course. We were probably one of the only companies who gave a full cycle of increment also, starting at the beginning of the year. And these are not something which were unplanned.

Yogesh Aggarwal · HSBC Securities

Once dust settles on tariff tantrums, do you think there are any new areas which could open up for the IT industry over the next one to two years?

Medium to long term, AI/GenAI is gaining a lot of traction and momentum. While the immediate focus has been on AI for IT, AI for Business is picking up traction. The second is, as we've been calling out, technology debt continues to be very high. So tech transformation in many forms - moving into cloud, moving out of legacy infrastructure - will gain steam, once people have more visibility and certainty on the medium to long-term.

Sudheer Guntupalli · Kotak Mahindra AMC

You're still talking about FY26 being better than FY25 despite 8% decline in full year bookings and macro deterioration. What gives you confidence?

We have had two quarters of good TCV. And that's the most important factor giving us confidence. And our belief - we can be wrong or believe that this uncertainty will be short-lived. Some clarity will emerge, and our clients will start investing towards more technology transformation programs. This is essentially based on client conversations we are having. And we believe some of the pauses we saw are more temporary.

Ravi Menon · Macquarie

Last quarter you talked about deal durations being lower meaning TCV converts faster. Should we think about FY25 deal wins in that context - although 8% lower YoY, ACV is higher because durations are lower?

Ravi, if I remember right, we talked about the deal cycles being shorter. They're shortening in Q3. We did not say the deal durations are shrinking. And the deal cycles continue to remain where it was at Q3 level. We did not say in Q3, the deal duration has shrunk.

Ravi Menon · Macquarie

The promotion cycle and wage hike deferrals seem to be conflicting signals. Were these promotions delayed from last April?

These promotions were planned and that's why they were carried out. The wage hikes are for FY '26. And that is why we are basically looking at the way there is uncertainty in the environment. Once clarity emerges, we will decide when do we carry out these wage hikes.

Ankur Rudra · JPMorgan

Can you clarify your comment about FY26 better than FY25 - is that for the whole business or only international?

It is for the international business. Definitely, we believe FY'26 will be stronger than FY'25. But there is also an expectation that once the uncertainty settles, there is an opportunity for us to deliver as a whole business also because we are constantly looking to replace the headwind. We are also constantly looking at opportunities to replace this revenue domestically and internationally also.

Ankur Rudra · JPMorgan

On the wage increase cycle - in the last cycle, when were such promotions given?

We have been giving promotions every year as per the cycle every quarter. We have done two cycles of promotions, as per the plan, and that has happened this year. This is done as per the plan for FY '25. There are absolutely no delays in this.

Ankur Rudra · JPMorgan

On AI for IT, is there any deflation you see in your existing order book? And on AI for Business, is this a net new opportunity funded by savings on legacy?

On AI for IT, I won't call it deflation. We try to deploy AI in every project we do. If there is a productivity gain because of AI, we will share those gains with our customers. So what we did with $100 we may now do with $90 or $95. And on AI for business, most of it would be net new because these are programs not done before at all. When there is cost optimization, some funding can come from savings on existing programs which can come from AI for IT, going towards funding new AI for business programs.

Apurva Prasad · Franklin Templeton

On the variability of about 2 percentage points from beginning of quarter expectation - was that largely a function of how March played out?

A good portion of that came from delays that happened in March. From the middle of February, some sectors started seeing chatter, particularly when consumer confidence fell towards the end of February. Some sectors had delays and deferrals starting in late February or third week of February, but a significant part of it is in March.

Apurva Prasad · Franklin Templeton

How do you see net impact of AI for business vs AI for IT playing out currently and over the next few years?

In one of our large deals we won, we demonstrated to our customer how AI for IT can save them significant cost. That resulted in the customer giving us a much larger portfolio and resulted in market share gain. For TCS, it proved to be net incremental in revenue, not deflationary. We are not seeing instances where AI for IT is creating deflationary situation, and after including AI for business, we see net-net positive at this time. But just keep in mind that all these projects, we are not talking about huge material number at this time.

Apurva Prasad · Franklin Templeton

On margins for FY26 - if international markets are better and software license/equipment cost impact is lower, what are the headwinds?

If the current uncertainty prevails, that can lead to lower operating leverage as utilization will be impacted and sudden contraction in demand delays or deferrals can have an impact on margins, so that is one headwind. Secondly, we might not enjoy the margin benefit coming from currency movement as we have seen in FY '25.

Vibhor Singhal · Nuvama Equities

Is the uncertainty/delayed decision-making across all segments or more in tariff-impacted verticals like manufacturing and retail?

There is some impact across the board, but there are some sectors more impacted than others. In our consumer business, retail, CPG, airlines, travel hospitality see more impact. There is impact in the auto sub segment within manufacturing. But if you take BFSI, by and large the segment is doing okay. There is some softness in insurance.

Vibhor Singhal · Nuvama Equities

Any color on hi-tech? Hyperscalers have been talking about softness.

Our hi-tech segment per se is not significantly impacted. But we classify professional services under the overall tech services umbrella. Professional services have some softness.

Vibhor Singhal · Nuvama Equities

If developed markets grow higher than FY25, should we expect FY26 margins to be better than FY25?

Our aspiration for revenue growth with profitability and operating margins getting closer to 26% still remains. To your direct question, yes, we should be able to improve margins. Broad-based revenue growth should bring in efficiencies and better operating leverage. The levers we have been banking on still continue to provide some potential like the ones of pyramid, productivity and realization.

Vibhor Singhal · Nuvama Equities

Any changes envisaged for hiring given the strong anti-immigration stand and H1B exposure?

It has been the same. Whatever H1B visas we got last year, our actual ratios are even better this year. Our model is global. We will continue to hire people globally and historically proven that these H1B visa do not affect our business model.

Gaurav Rateria · Morgan Stanley

On talent strategy for AI for Business - any change in mix of hiring from campus or laterals?

If you look at our trainee intake, the percentage of hires we have in digital is 40% compared to 17% last year. So that definitely changes the mix - and 50% of our lateral hires are coming in with high-end skills, including AI/GenAI and others as well.

Gaurav Rateria · Morgan Stanley

Getting into 1Q, how would you see your visibility for the quarter compared to last year?

When we got into Q1 of last year, probably we had more visibility than what we have today. But at the same time, we are entering the quarter with two good quarters of TCV also. I believe this current uncertainty will be more short lived and more clarity will emerge. Once that emerges, we'll be very confident of the quarter. So compared to last Q1, maybe there is more uncertainty. But at the same time, we are entering with a strong TCV and pipeline for the future.

Kumar Rakesh · BNP Paribas

On 60bps margin impact from marketing exercises - is that one-time or recurring? And on promotion spending vs last year?

On the 60 basis points - these were mainly marketing interventions, higher travel, some purpose-driven initiatives or CSR expense. Nothing unusual, you'll have pluses and minuses each quarter. So it's not very significant to call out as an exceptional or onetime item.

Kumar Rakesh · BNP Paribas

Going forward, do you have reasonable confidence that this momentum should continue into next year? Has pipeline been steady or positive Q-o-Q?

TCV is very difficult to predict because it changes based on even the customer delays a decision by a week or two, it can cross over a quarter. What we can talk about is our pipeline. Our pipeline continues to be strong at a very high level and so it gives us the confidence. As decisions are being made, we will have a strong win rate, and we'll be able to report a good TCV. It has been steady and slowly increasing.

Prepared remarks (5 blocks)
Good day, everyone. I'm pleased to announce that we are concluding FY '25 by surpassing the <strong>$30 billion</strong> revenue milestone. We have achieved this while maintaining industry-leading margins, exceptional return ratios and a strong balance sheet. It is very gratifying to see that most of our leadership team has been part of TCS' extraordinary journey, growing 14 times in the last two decades. Our financial year 2025 revenue grew by 4.2% in constant currency. Our operating margin for the year came in at 24.3%. Our net margin was at 19%. Coming to our more recent performance, our Q4 revenues grew 2.5% on a constant currency basis. All major markets grew sequentially. Our record Q4 TCV of $12.2 billion demonstrates our ability to gain market share. North America TCV reached an all-time high of $6.8 billion. BFSI TCV was $4 billion, and Consumer Business Group contributed $1.7 billion. This impressive performance stands out in the absence of mega deals.
Good day, everyone. Our workforce at the end of FY '25 was 607,979. We continue to enjoy pride of place as the employer of choice by prioritizing a culture of professional and personal growth, well-being and purpose-driven engagement. Over LTM attrition was stable at <strong>13.3%</strong>. During the year, we strengthened our current pipeline through strategic investment in scale development. Our campus hiring program is progressing as planned, and we are gearing up to onboard an increased number of campus hires in FY '26. TCS is ranked number 1 in AI and data certifications across three Hyperscalers and GitHub. The associates have locked 56 million learning hours and acquired 5.2 million competencies in FY '25.
I'm pleased with the performance this quarter in a challenging global macroeconomic environment. All major markets grew sequentially, and we are proud to successfully deliver a nation-building transformation engagement in our growth market. We also saw a second consecutive quarter of very strong TCV, which consisted of a good mix of large, medium and small deals, which augurs well for future revenue visibility. We are seeing TCV improvement across markets as clients prioritize initiatives around technology modernization, cost optimization, vendor consolidation, operational model transformation risk and compliance.
We have all been witnessing an increased level of uncertainty in the global economic and geopolitical landscape in the last few weeks, making a shift from our commentary in January. We have seen instances of delays in decision-making and discretionary spending has come under heightened scrutiny and pressure recently. In Q4, AI, GenAI, data and cloud IoT, DE and enterprise solutions drove strong client engagements and growth. Our pipeline of AI, GenAI engagement is higher than in the last few quarters, and we saw a significant increase in deal wins across AI for IT and AI for business.
Good day, everyone. I will start with the full year's numbers and then proceed to the quarterly commentary. For the full year, our revenue was <strong>$30.2 billion</strong>, a year-on-year growth of 4.2% in constant currency. The revenue growth is 3.8% in dollar terms and 6% in rupee terms. Our FY '25 operating margin was at 24.3%, a decline of 30 basis points over the prior year. During the year, we had a 200-basis point headwind resulting from annual wage increases and other tactical interventions for our associates such as promotions. We had a further 130 basis points headwind from continuing investments in infrastructure and capability building. To mitigate these headwinds, we focused on improving utilization, productivity and realization. Additionally, we received an 80-basis point support from the currency. Net margins for FY '25 were 19% and our EPS grew 5.1% year-on-year. Our effective tax rate for the year was 25.3%. The Board has recommended a final dividend of Rs.30 per share, bringing our total dividend for the year to Rs.126 per share. Coming to Q4, for the quarter ending 31st March '25, our revenue increased by 2.5% year-on-year in constant currency terms, reaching Rs.64,479, that translates to a growth of 5.3% in rupee terms and our dollar revenues were at 7.47 billion, Y-o-Y growth of 1.4%. Our Q4 operating margin stood at 24.2%, reflecting a sequential decline of 30 basis points. During the quarter, we incurred 100 basis points headwind due to tactical interventions.
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